The part of the recession where we all shiv each other over the last donut.

[leahbobet]

And I guess I'm not immune. Things like this still make me unholy angry.

If you are not yet sufficiently acquainted with me to find the bit that pisses me off yourself, I'll quote:

Jan Lancaster's story drew a great deal of response from our listeners. Jan lost a job with a construction company, after a long and satisfying career as an executive administrative assistant. The hardest part of getting back on her feet? Wearing a uniform as a cashier at Canadian Tire.

Jan's bald honesty about what it's like to face acquaintances and friends from the wrong side of the counter, starkly framed the whole experience of what it means to lose a job in this economy. In Jan's life, the uniform had become a mute metaphor for what it meant to exchange a job she was proud of for one that felt beneath her, a job as ill-fitting as the uniform that goes with it.

Excuse me, CBC? Run that by me again?

Jan's bald honesty about what it's like to face acquaintances and friends from the wrong side of the counter--

I thought you said that.

Listen up. I spent ten years of my working life, since literally three weeks after I turned sixteen and was legal to work, on the, ahem, wrong side of the counter. I recognize all too clearly that the jobs I worked during that time placed me and my co-workers, in many people's estimations, beneath them (insert the bit about how North Americans pretend to not have social class here. It'll save me typing). Some of those jobs I hated and did anyways, because I needed to pay my rent and eat food. Some of them paid me minimum wage and practically no hours, and I loved and looked forward to them. Some were fairly indifferent. Yes, some of them had uniforms or dress expectations.

None of them caused me shame.

I don't know if the tone of this article is a result of the reporter or the people interviewed, and yes. It is an emotional blow to lose a job you have invested effort and identity and time into. All those things are true. But working a service industry job is not a source of shame.

The ability to get for yourself a roof and a meal is a glorious thing. That you can, when for so many reasons so many people can't. That's independence and self-reliance, and even when it isn't fun, it's a big deal.

So I would not hesitate to scrub toilets to keep myself fed. And I'd scrub them to the best of my ability as long as I had to, in front of anyone you please. Without shame.

Because there is no shame in self-reliance.

Comments

[copperwise.livejournal.com]

That is obnoxious. There is no shame in a job well done. Any job. God.

[leahbobet.livejournal.com]

Indeed. It all fights the goddamned entropy back.

[stillnotbored.livejournal.com]

You know...the job I've hated most in my entire working life was the one supposed to be most upscale--the job at the bank.

The bookstore jobs, the framing store and the fabric store were all 'apron jobs' and I loved them all. If I could get them to hire me again (if they had jobs to hire me for) I'd go back to any of them. I've applied at all the book stores in town, some of them twice.

I don't get that attitude.

[dichroic.livejournal.com]

Certain retail jobs look a lot more fun than others, though, and I think the stores that people come into becuase they love the thing it's about would be best. Guitar stores. Climbing and adventure-gear stores. Local yarn shops. Bookstores. Fabric stores.

[wirewalking.livejournal.com]

*blink blink*

I .. can't even wrap my brain around that.

[dichroic.livejournal.com]

At one point I worked in an aerospace engineering group that had a lot of recently hired engineers who had been laid off from McDonnell-Douglas and who had spent months out of work. One woman ended up in the hospital with heart problems during that time - she'd so identified with her job that losing it almost killed her, literally. Another man had spent some time between the two engineering jobs working in a convenience store - he had four kids and did what it took to feed them. Now *that's* honorable work. (He was also an Orthodox priest, but apparently that job is either not paid or not full-time - I didn't get the details.)

I guess I imprinted on Lazurus Long at an early age - something like "I have shoveled human excrement, standing in it up to my knees, rather than let a child go hungry." Supporting yourself is no less honorable - I believe an adult should do some kind of work for the majority of her life, one way or another, paid or not. Art and retail, engineering and medicine and volunteering and parenting are all work. If you enjoy the kind of work you're doing, so much the better.

[leahbobet.livejournal.com]

One woman ended up in the hospital with heart problems during that time - she'd so identified with her job that losing it almost killed her, literally.

I saw something similar this past year with a family member, where the job that she's held for at least ten years in an organization she's been with her whole career ceased to exist and she was shuffled around between departments, sort of work-homeless. It was a real blow; there's a lot of implicit saying that the work one's been doing for years and years was actually not valuable after all. And that's hard.

[gailmom.livejournal.com]

As someone who can no longer work, who loved every minute of her job rolling burritos in a uniform apron and hat, who is STILL proud, multiple years later, of the fact that she was an excellent receptionist for a small company downtown (where part of the job description was vacuuming the front office every day) and who was only ever wrongfully fired (ha! never try to work for 'christian right' bosses on a campus where you have been an active member and/or officer in the Pagan Student Association and the GLBTA) from a more "upscale" work environment at the University where she was a 'senior secretary'....fuck the author and the silver spoon fed horse he or she rode in on.

No job is shameful, and in this sort of economy, poor little miss Jan ought to be damn pleased she has a uniform to put on every day, and the attendant paycheck to take home, instead of having to stand in line at the job office or watch her family suffer because they don't or can't qualify for the dwindling supplies of welfare now that government budgets have been cut by the very Republicans who now refuse to accept large portions of the President's stimulus package.

In fact, I may go see if it's possible to leave a similar comment on the article. Please excuse me....

[leahbobet.livejournal.com]

In fact, I may go see if it's possible to leave a similar comment on the article. Please excuse me....

If my opinion matters on this one, I'd rather you didn't? I'm not pointing this out so this woman who's suffered what is, to her, a very negative experience can be pilloried by random members of the public. It's entirely possible, too, that these aren't her attitudes, but the reporter's.

We aren't here to increase pain, is all.

[joycemocha.livejournal.com]

I am so with you on that--cafeteria busser, waitress, hotel room cleaner--oh yeah, BTDT.

Absolutely no shame in self-reliance.

[haruhiko.livejournal.com]

WTF? In this fucked up economy someone is actually butthurt that they managed to find a ~low-class~ job after losing their ~proper~ one? Let me play my tiniest violin for them.

When I was job-hunting I told myself I would rule out retail for the first month of job-hunting--not because I have shame over retail work but because I wanted a job with consistent hours, no commission-based bullshit, no "required" overtime, holidays off, etc. Still, after a month of searching? You can bet your sweet ass I was out there pounding the pavement visiting every goddamn strip mall asking all the businesses if they were hiring.

There is no shame in work, unless you work for Xe Blackwater or KBR or something.

[leahbobet.livejournal.com]

To be fair, I don't know if that's the person's feeling on it or the journalist threading together a meta-narrative. Either way, I'm not down with this idea of shame.

[coffeeem.livejournal.com]

Hello? Paycheck AND a Canadian Tire employee discount? Dude, I'd look good in that uniform.

[leahbobet.livejournal.com]

We'll...start with you? :D

[amysisson.livejournal.com]

Great post!

I waitressed full time for a year in Grand Forks, North Dakota, because that was the best paying work I could find.

And I was a damn good waitress and proud of it.

[leahbobet.livejournal.com]

Yeah. I did telemarketing for a summer because SARS had cleaned out the tourist industry and all the people in the tourist industry had snarfed up the other summer jobs. It was the only thing I could find. It was not a job I enjoyed or would have sought out otherwise.

But, y'know. I did my best and finished the contract, and I did survive the process.

[tithenai.livejournal.com]

there is no shame in self-reliance.

You said it.

Come on, CBC, I'm signing petitions for YOU not to become a casualty of our alleged minority Conservative government of EVIL the economy! Stop making me cringe!

I think that everyone should have the experience of working retail at some point in their lives. Maybe then there'd be less abuse of retail employees.

The thing is, though, given the amount of people who DO think that there's a "wrong" side of the counter -- as evidenced by this reporter's tone, and the "great deal of response" this drew -- I don't doubt for a minute that Jan Lancaster faced smug condescension, contempt, and the most patronising kind of pity from her acquaintances. I wouldn't entirely blame her for internalising something that's so consistently reinforced in our society.

(Edited for punctuation)

[leahbobet.livejournal.com]

I think that everyone should have the experience of working retail at some point in their lives. Maybe then there'd be less abuse of retail employees.

I wish I still thought that'd work (I did for a long time). There are too many people who...well, once they get out of a situation where they were taking abuse, turn right around and start abusing the people still there even harder just to prove that they're not on the bottom anymore. Sigh.

The thing is, though, given the amount of people who DO think that there's a "wrong" side of the counter -- as evidenced by this reporter's tone, and the "great deal of response" this drew -- I don't doubt for a minute that Jan Lancaster faced smug condescension, contempt, and the most patronising kind of pity from her acquaintances. I wouldn't entirely blame her for internalising something that's so consistently reinforced in our society.

Oh, yeah. And I don't really blame her? It's a social attitude that's in the air; it's not like she made it up herself.

I just wish there was, in general, an acknowledgment that it's not that job that's a source of immediate and unquestioned stigma, but that...well, her friends and acquaintances are assholes.

[kriz1818.livejournal.com]

But - but - but - this is the FYOOCHUR! Nobody in North America should have to do anything they don't wanna!

(Ahem.)

At least, nobody educated and high-class. Entitlement anyone?

I'll admit I'm vaguely proud that I've never worked in retail, but that's mainly because it's downright WEIRD that I haven't. And lucky, because in my 20s I couldn't have done a job that required regular contact with the public.

[moon-custafer.livejournal.com]

in my 20s I couldn't have done a job that required regular contact with the public.

I'm pretty sure the only reason I can now is because of the meds.

[kythiaranos.livejournal.com]

Well said.

[shiroiko.livejournal.com]

I'm going to be honest, I have some sympathy for her. It is very hard when you're a well-paid professional to drop down to retail or other similar work, ESPECIALLY lower-end retail like Canadian Tire (this really can't be compared to great retail jobs like working in a bookstore).

I agree with the rest of you, that you do what you have to do to survive and you do it well. But I completely disagree that it has no psychological effects; in particular, the effects dropping down to a job that likely pays minimum wage or just barely above.

There is no way to survive on that wage, and it HURTS when you are used to being able to financially care for yourself and you no longer are able to. I know I am consistently depressed and shaken because in the past I was able to take full financial care of myself, but in my current job I would be unable to without my boyfriend's help because the pay is just that low.

I also remember the experience my mom had when I was growing up. She had been doing social work for years and then decided to go to finally get her Bachelors degree from U of T. On graduating she was unable to get a job that utilized her degree, and all the social work jobs she applied for said she was overqualified. In order for our family to survive she cleaned houses and took whatever jobs she could find... and with all this hard work we were still VERY POOR. It's also the main reason we moved to Florida... where my mom found work, but it was work that had long hours and paid horrifically badly. It took years for her to finally get a job with any kind of livable wage again.

I admire my mom for what she did to keep our family afloat, but I am also completely aware of the psychological toll this took on her. She went to university and left a decent job to better herself, and then left university only to be able to find low-end jobs with sustenance-level pay at best. It hurt her so much to be working so hard at jobs that could have been done by robots and still, despite that hard work, have trouble paying for the basic necessities... especially since in the past she had been able to do so.

Do not negate the shame and depression of someone who worked hard to have a dependable job that paid well and now feels bad because she had to take a job that requires very little of you and pays very little as well.

[hooks-and-books.livejournal.com]

I can understand that mentality, especially when one is used to a certain level of comfort of life, and all of a sudden that's taken away from them.

There is pain there, and frustration, and often a sense of rage or even betrayal. At least there was for me. But I was never ashamed at what I did to feed my son. My jobs were honest, legal and served a purpose. Yes, they are psychologically and physically taxing, but not from a sense of shame.

[carolhelga.livejournal.com]

In today's work climate, any job is a good job, so long as it pays your bills and lets you support yourself and your family. So what if you're one of those highly educated folks who "deserve" a better job?

One of my favorite jobs before I started teaching was when I worked for a veterinarian as a kennel cleaner. Got that, world? A kennel-cleaner! I loved the job, despite the reactions I'd get when I talked about what I did. (Actually the job also involved feeding and watering, walking, grooming, holding dying pets, helping with clerical stuff, and running samples to the lab/results back to the office.)

If I were to (God forbid) lose my current job, sure I'd look for something equivilent, but I would have no issues taking what I could find, even if it was one of those invisible jobs no one wants to admit we need done.

[eredien]

I also liked my kennel-cleaning job. It had better co-workers than my most well-paid job, and somewhat less office politics.

Class consciousness and self-reliance...

[dlandon.livejournal.com]

Amen, sister.

And I'd add, from my own experiences, how strange people found it when I decided not to go back to finance for a while and pour coffee at Starbucks instead. It was completely unfathomable to them that I'd leave a high profile career behind and take a job that provided me with what I needed - health insurance and freedom - but in their minds was 'beneath me' in order to pursue something I loved. And the reaction of customers when they found out I had a college degree and had worked in finance...!

It was quite the interesting social experiment.
- D

Re: Class consciousness and self-reliance...

[leahbobet.livejournal.com]

When I was in high school or early university I had a habit of trading up jobs that required all of me -- brains, hands, whatever -- for jobs that just required a warm body sometimes. They gave me time to think.

[hawkwing-lb.livejournal.com]

Wrong side of the counter? The what now?

That's the kind of thing one would expect from an obnoxious aristocrat, not a reporter.

(Personally, I would love to be on the 'wrong' side of the counter, if it meant I could support myself.)

[katfeete.livejournal.com]

Try working in ag sometime.

I can't count the number of times I mentioned my work background to people in Waterloo and got a Look, or even a puzzled, "You farm? But... you seem so... intelligent...."

Waterloo was about the worst (also the place I had a long argument with someone about what people who didn't go to university "deserved"), but yeah. Farmer = hick. Period. It's one of the reasons I don't follow James Nicholl's blog anymore either.

[pwyrzykowski.livejournal.com]

Heh. Funny, you wouldn't happen to be an immigrant, would you? 'Cause I swear I can hear echoes of every immigrant family I've ever known, including my own, in that rant.

Yes, self-reliance is good. And no, there should be no shame in doing service jobs, or any other kind of jobs, for that matter. I think it's hard not to feel that shame, though, when you suddenly start being treated worse than you're used to being treated because of the job you are doing. It's one thing to work as a sales clerk while you're in school - that's fairly common in North America, and nobody will think less of you for it. It's an entirely different thing to work up to a certain level of authority, and then have that taken away from you - as, for instance, when you're a trained medical doctor and are suddenly being treated with condescention by customers who assume that anyone who works retail at the age of fourty, and, God forbid, doesn't speak good English, must be somehow lacking.

[shiroiko.livejournal.com]

I agree most wholeheartedly.

I trained to be a teacher. I moved from the US back to Canada a few years back and by the time I jumped through all my certification hurdles I ended up in one of the worst times to find a teaching job in Ontario. I took a receptionist job to pay the bills, but I really did feel that pain of being treated as less intelligent than my peers at work despite my professional training as a teacher (which many of my co-workers actually were aware of).

You really are treated differently depending on what job you have (and, like you mentioned, the age at which you're in that job). I think everyone here agrees that's not right, but we really shouldn't deny that it's true. Also,even the most self-assured people can be affected by how they're treated by others.

[hooks-and-books.livejournal.com]

Wow...I'm sort of struggling to understand that lack of awareness in the article.

I have worked in the restaurant service industry, on and off, since I was 16 and hireable. There is nothing bad or shameful or wrong about these jobs.

At best, one might argue that they're humbling or enlightening, but no more so than any other job. It has always been my contention that every citizen needs to work a restaurant job for a year, and understand how much you should tip a server, and what it's like to live on 10% tips as opposed to 20%.

But you're right--the ability put a roof over your head and food in your belly is quickly becoming a luxury that not everyone has, and those that have it by honest means should certainly feel no dishonor in that.

[blades-of-grass.livejournal.com]

I remember how I absolutely loved a job as a cleaner in an office building. It had a clothes exporter company, a travel agency, a fabric dye company, a knitwear company and an embassy (at least on the floors assigned to me).

Apart from breathtaking views to the sea and the cobbled promenade and the burnt-orange tiled roofs, it had the most fascinating things inside: like the dye laboratory and the sculpture made out of multicoloured socks and the huge, walk-in closet sized, great-great-greatgrandfather clock in the embassy suite.

[blades-of-grass.livejournal.com]

There was a discussion in a Russian Lj about a post that mirrored the CBC story (a former office worker, now jobless, says that working practically anywhere else but an office is for her a horrible disgrace). I linked to your post in a comment to show that such attitudes are common.

I hope that's OK.

[barbarienne.livejournal.com]

I'm not sure how you're meaning this. Are you angry at the worker (Jan) for feeling shame, or at the society that makes people who have these jobs feel shame?

I agree with you 100% that any job well done deserves respect and honor, and the people who do it should be able to feel pride.

But if you're angry at Jan, I can't get on board with that. She feels the way she feels.

I interpreted the phrase "wrong side of the counter" to be from Jan's point of view, an expression used as "creative nonfiction" to convey how she is feeling. I hope she's able to shed her cultural bias and take pride in her job regardless of what other people say, and perhaps demonstrate their erroneous thinking to them.

[leahbobet.livejournal.com]

Your pertinent paragraph would be: "I don't know if the tone of this article is a result of the reporter or the people interviewed, and yes. It is an emotional blow to lose a job you have invested effort and identity and time into. All those things are true. But working a service industry job is not a source of shame."

[obake.livejournal.com]

Wait, let me call the wahmbulance.

...

Jobs is jobs. There are plenty of stories of CEOs now serving tables. I say it's good for them to get a taste of what it's like to be in the service industry. So many people move beyond the service industry and feel like suddenly it's their right to look down on people who are still doing those jobs.

Frankly, the job in which I had the most fun and personal growth was pulling espresso. I made minimum wage plus tips and I loved it. I loved making the regulars smile and making someone's day brighter with a smile and a cup of coffee.

[leahbobet.livejournal.com]

Yeah, there's a point in, well, regulars. Once I started working this job, I noticed that my social life, well, constricted. Because I was used to seeing my regulars every weekend.

[kmkibble75.livejournal.com]

I'd assume the writer was going for a 'wrong side of the tracks' type of ironic construction, but if so I think quotes are necessary. But they weren't there, so I agree with your reaction.

[kats-kradle.livejournal.com]

One of the, many, issues I have with my father is the fact that over the years he felt it was beneath him to do anything but be in the upper tiers of whatever company he was trying to be part of. His goal was always that if it was below a certain level of prestige/pay/power then it was not worth his time, even when we went hungry for weeks and literally had no shoes. He firmly held on to, and expressed often, the idea that he would suicide before he 'stooped so low'. I'm not even talking about jobs that involved a uniform. Working as a clerk, or working under someone instead of being in charge of a team was demeaning to him.

[feed-your-muse.livejournal.com]

I don't have a problem with working in a service industry (I'm an academic librarian now, so in some ways I'm probably still *in* the service industry as a lot of my work is outward facing) because when I was 14 my Dad decided it would be great if I worked at weekends / in the summer. Luckily I lived in a seaside town near a caravan park, so I cleaned caravans on Saturdays during the season (and some people left them in a disgusting condition); when I was 16 I worked in the fast food restaurant; 18 I worked in the bar, and then the main reception until I graduated from university.
It gave me money I wouldn't have had otherwise, and helped me build up immunity to people who're rude just because they can be. (And it improved my customer care skills because I was always 'on' being visible all the time. For people who've been laid off it may not be the job they were hoping for, but it *is* a job and if your (one's) former colleagues look down on you for that - well, that's why they were colleagues and not friends.

Merry

[leahbobet.livejournal.com]

that's why they were colleagues and not friends.

Yes.

Friends want you to be fed, housed, and as okay with yourself as you can possibly be at any point in time. They do not pile more rocks on your chest.